Ep #87: Barb Patterson on What to Do When You Don’t Know What to Do in Your Business

by | Podcast

Confession—I feel like I have this secret treasure in my life, where I can go to remind myself who I am and what’s possible for me, my work and this whole human experience. And, now the secret is OUT! 

I’m introducing you today to Barb Patterson, founder of Beyond Limits in Business. In this conversation, Barb helps us see how we are immensely resilient, innovative and powerful in business. 

In fact, what Barb shares in this episode is at the heart of what has allowed me to experience life in a profoundly new way. 

Right now, it sure SEEMS like the circumstances of our world could wreck our mental health, our security….but, the truth is, even now, in the midst of all of this, we are so, so resilient and capable…if but for the thinking that tells us otherwise.

So, when tuning in to today’s episode with Barb Patterson, if you get even a glimmer into the bigness of this way of seeing yourself and what you’re capable of, I know it will have a very real positive impact in your life and work. 

I am thrilled to share this conversation with Barb Patterson with you to inspire you to see what you're capable of in your own life and business, too, so tune in below to today’s Brilliance at Work podcast episode.

About Barb Patterson:

Barb Patterson is the owner of a global coaching and consulting company bringing the insights of state-of-mind & performance to clients around the world. She helps leaders, entrepreneurs and coaches access more resiliency, clarity & creativity, resulting in greater impact and higher levels of performance & fulfillment in work and life. Barb is the Founder of Beyond Limits in Business and host of the Real Business Real Lives podcast. You can follow Barb on Linkedin and Instagram. You can learn more about her and subscribe to her weekly blog on her website at barbarapatterson.com.

What You’ll Learn from this Episode:

  • What I mean when I say that everything is different but nothing has changed
  • Barb Patterson's advice for bring the deep, rich brilliance within you into your own work in the world and why the timing for this is now
  • How Barb transitioned from strategy and planning and leading teams in her business and what transformation she went through to get to her new way of doing business
  • How to look at your thoughts with more neutrality and why doing so puts you into a freer, more neutral mind where your inner knowing will guide you.
  • Discover how to develop a different relationship to thought and feeling.
  • Hear how Barb is thinking about doing things differently now and how she’s talking with leaders about this

Listen to the Full Barb Patterson Episode:

Featured On The Show:

PREVIOUS EPISODE | Ep #86: How to Build Your Business When You're Stuck at Home

NEXT EPISODE | Ep #88: How to Stop Overthinking Your Work & Life


Full Barb Patterson Episode Transcript:


Welcome to the Brilliance at Work podcast where we shine a light on where great work, charisma and leadership that makes a positive difference really comes from, I'm Michelle Barry Franco. I'm an executive coach speaking coach and your honored host and I'm delighted that you're here. Hello my beautiful well

Brilliant friends. I am just beyond delighted to share this interview with you. I feel like I have this secret treasure in my life, this place where I can go to remind myself who I am and what's possible for me, for my work and really this whole human experience and now this secret is going to be out. It just makes me really happy because Barb Patterson, who I had this wonderful conversation with, that I get to share with you, what she shares in this episode is really at the heart of what has allowed me to experience my life in a profoundly new way. So if you get even a glimmer into the bigness of this way of seeing yourself and what's possible for you, what you're capable of, I know that it will have a very real impact in your life and in your work. That's how it's been for me.

We often describe the impact of seeing how we work at this level as something like everything has changed, but nothing is different and that's kind of what I want for you. Maybe that doesn't sound like that big of a deal, but really what this has meant for me is that there's a calm and a peace and a really deep knowing, a deep sense of security that is there now for me all the time, no matter what's happening on the outside. That is absolutely not the way it was for me for a very long time. Now, of course you can take this into a lot of different contexts. It's true in my parenting, it's true in my marriage, it's true, and my relationship with my family members, my extended family members, but we talk a lot about it in this conversation around business of course, because that is a lot of what we're talking about here on the brilliance at work podcast.

It's about how do you bring this deep, rich brilliance within you into your own work in the world and the thing is right now it sure seems like the circumstances of our world could wreck our mental health. You're hearing that you're hearing say, I know that you don't feel good or that you don't feel that anxiety is off the charts for you or you're panicking right now and I hear these things and I think, Oh my gosh, should I be panicking? My brain does this whole like is something wrong with me if I'm not, but I think part of the reason that I'm not is really what Barbara and I talk about in this conversation. So I'm just so delighted that I get to bring you into this cause. The truth is even now in the midst of all of this that we're going through with the pandemic going on coven 19 we are so amazingly resilient and capable if but for the thinking that tells us otherwise.

The only thing in the way of us seeing our innate resilience and capability as a bunch of thought that very naturally shows up in our brain. I have found that the more and more we look toward that and see the truth in that separation between the thoughts that go through our mind and who we really are, we can keep looking toward who we really are and find so much possibility. That's where the glimmer starts to glow even when things feel really hard. So I was introduced to Barb through Amy Johnson and I had Amy Johnson on the podcast a while ago. She's a very good friend of Barb's. She's been an incredible teacher for me and really is the one who introduced me to this understanding. So they've both been really important teachers in my life and I'm so grateful to have mentors like Barb and Amy to help me navigate this whole wild human ride.

Honestly, my life is a lot different having been introduced to this way of seeing who we really are. This is not like a new model, not a new strategy for you to take in. There's no new practice that we're introducing to you here. This is really a way of seeing ourselves. What I love about what Barb shares is that she's committed to helping us see how we are immensely resilient, innovative, and powerful in the business realm. She is who I go to for that reminder. A little formal background about Barb. Barb Patterson is the owner of a global coaching and consulting company bringing the insights of state of mind and performance to clients all around the world. She helps leaders, entrepreneurs and coaches access more resiliency, clarity and creativity resulting in greater impact and higher levels of performance and fulfillment in their work and in their life.

That's definitely been my experience. Barbara is the founder of beyond limits in business and host of the real business real lives podcast, which I highly recommend you want to add that to your listening. You can follow Barb on LinkedIn and Instagram and we'll put all of the links to her social inside the show notes and you can learn more about her and subscribe to her weekly blog on her website@barbarapatterson.com so I am just so delighted. I can't wait for you to get to listen into this conversation. Here is Barb Patterson. Barb, I am so excited to have you here today. Thank you for being here.

Barb Patterson:

Yeah, thank you for asking. I'm glad to be here.


Yeah, so I can't wait to really mostly what, what I would love for you to do because it's been so valuable to me as a business owner to get to hear your story in different forms over time. I would love if you would just talk about, you know, I know that you come from a traditional, a traditional business background where you did a lot of strategy and planning and leading teams and you know, I'm sure I'll learn even more in this conversation and I would love for you to just kind of talk about what it was like for you when you were in that part of your business doing business in that way. Then I know that you went through a significant transformation, a transition from that way of thinking about business to what I see as a whole new way of thinking about business. I'm just excited for people to hear that story. Would you share it?


Yeah, absolutely.  I have spent my adult life and maybe even most of my childhood but looking in the direction of transformation and how do we bring our best selves to whatever we're up to. In my career I have been involved in personal development, professional development, leadership development and organizational development. And that has taken shape by at different times. I had my own consulting business, but I've also been an executive that ran a global talent management leadership and all of learning department and function. I lived over in Paris most recently before I left to start the business I'm currently in. So this idea of development, transformation, change success really has been something I've been curious about my whole life and in my training and you know, some of that training was like on the streets, right? You know, literally growing up inside companies, taking different trainings, things that I've been interested in myself, but then also getting developed professionally.

I've kind of, I've had a mix of psychology training. I've had organizational development training, I've had behavioral training and kind of training. I've done a ton around personality assessments and all of that. What I would say is I loved it all, you know, and I found value in most of it for sure. Whatever I learned, I took with me. I used that when I, whether I had my own business or I was inside of a company and you know, I would use that to develop individuals, to develop teams, to develop cultures, all of that. I think the best way to say it was, you know, in this most recent job when I was living over in Europe and running that function, I had the opportunity to travel all over the world to work with leaders from all over the world.

Then also as a result to have exposure to a lot of different thought leaders on much of, you know, these topics. Right? I had a lot of freedom inside my company to also bring in new ideas and part of that was we had a great relationship. You know, I feel like they gave me a wonderful opportunity. They developed me, they promoted me, all that. Then also I gave a lot of my heart and soul to that organization and yet about 10 years ago now, I started to feel this pull to want to go back to doing my own business again. It was just kind of, I think everyone can relate and kind of one of those, the knowing that it was just time and it was something I wanted to do, but I was definitely not running from anything.

I loved the company and the people and everything that I was doing, but I just felt like it was time and I share that because I know a lot of your listeners are maybe at these kind of points in their life where they're feeling really drawn into a particular direction, but trying to sort out the when and the how and the why and all of that. I just want to take a moment to say that wherever we're at, whatever we're up to in that moment, it can be full with purpose and relevance and meaning. That's really good news and more we give ourselves permission to kind of lean into what we're drawn. We will naturally find this momentum in this direction that'll help us, and I'll speak more to that. What I mean by that, Michelle, but I just, I wanted to take a pause there and the story for that.


Yeah, I'm glad you did and it's making me think about right now, given the pandemic and all of the sort of more, the way I like to describe it as the more known uncertainty. It's like there was always uncertainty, but now we're all super aware of it. I wonder if you think about that moment, I'm these people that you're calling out to right now and maybe they were feeling like that right before and then there's this sudden like, Oh wow, but at least I still have a job. It's just occurring to me. Like, I don’t know. Any thoughts on that?


Yeah. Here's what I would say. There is no right way to do this. Listen, I felt that pull, you know, when we tell a story, it always sounds so linear and cleaner, if it really went down in real life. Let's just say that, right? I started feeling that restlessness, that kind of internal pull long before I actually went in and quit and it was about a year or when I got really clear that this, that moving on was going to be my next step. Then my journey, I could feel it wasn't time for a variety of reasons and they're not important here. What I had to learn to do was to listen and follow kind of the knowing of the time and deal with my own impatience. That's what I would say is I think beyond the noise and the impatience and that kind of the grass being it always looks like all of our hopes and dreams are in that next step.

Right, and to really just come back and say, can I look at what is with more neutrality and the more we do that in a freer, more neutral mind, our knowing will guide us. I knew it wasn't time to leave, but I definitely had moments where I was impatient. I lived in the future a lot. I would want to hurry through things like all of that was there too, but beyond the kind of day to day emotions and thinking, I could also hear like, no, no, you're not yet. Not yet. I just had to get okay about that and that's what I would say for people right now is who knows this opportunity may be making it more possible for you to do right. Others it may be a, let's just wait and see like it will be unique, but your wisdom will come through for you. I think the hard part is we got to quiet down enough to listen and hear it.


Yeah. Yeah. That's so true. And it's so, for so many of us, I know, especially just a few years ago, my reaction to current circumstances would have been, what can I do? What can I do? You know, what do I need to read? What do I need? What meditation do I need to play all day? So that all be calm enough to weather the feelings. It is kind of counterintuitive to, I think, so much of what we are taught about what to do when we're having all of these feelings that many of us might be having right now. Yeah. Yeah, going to your story,


What I know that it doesn't matter exactly what the thing was, but I still think I kind of liked the movie of it as well. What happens? Well, I think what happened then was eventually the knowing that it was time got really solid in me. I went and I spoke to my boss and the CEO and let them know and you know, and then that, by the way also took a little bit of time, you know, like things take time and, but, and they asked me to stay a little longer than I had thought I would, but it made sense and I said yes. You know, when I, at that point though, I decided to, I was going to move back to the States and I wanted to hire a coach. In my mind, I was hiring this coach to help me stay on track, to be a thinking partner, to be strategic, to kind of, you know, help me hit the ground running and like ensure success in my business.

Well, I came across an individual, Michael Neil, who some of your listeners may or may not know, but at the time I decided to work with him. He started sharing with me an understanding that completely transformed and shifted kind of how I move in the world. I'll share like I'll do my best in a short conversation to share, but how I would put that is in this understanding, this work, I started to have a different relationship to thought. I started to understand the role that thought was having and shaping everything that thought had in shaping what I thought I was capable of. What I thought my potential was, the role that thought was having on my moods, on my state of mind. I, of course in, in kind of my history, I had already had this awareness that thought was having an effect on me.

I knew like, Oh yeah, you don't want to be negative because that's just right, but there was, I thought I had to manage my thinking. I thought I had to get positive thinking. I thought I had to like get my vibration up so I could, you know, like there was a lot of managing it that it looked like to me. In this work in particular, what Michael was my first teacher, and I've since said that many amazing mentors, but really what it is, is do we see that we live in the feeling of thought and that it's shaping everything. That there is a relationship between the quality of my own mind and the moment. It's shaping my view of myself. It's shaping my feelings. It's shaping whether I see opportunity or I don't it shaping, do I see possibilities?

It's there is a role that moment to moment our minds are having on, on that and, and what I want to say about that is that was an invisible variable to me. Like I said, I had some inkling of it, but when I realized, Oh there's state of mind is having a huge implication moment to moment, but we underappreciate it and don't see it in 10 years ago that was even more true than it is now. I think it's becoming more and more visible, but when I saw it, I always used to be curious like why I can change in one area but not the area I really want. Why can some leaders and entrepreneurs that I work with have the best intentions but not, not be able to change in a way that sticks and prior based on all my other education, what I shared earlier, it would have, I would have went after it from a place of, Oh, maybe there's something in their past they have to get over. Maybe it's their personality, maybe it's their strengths and weaknesses and they need to learn something. Maybe it's, you know, their environment. I just write, I would have addressed the whole person, but I would have had to look at all these different things and it was very complex. Now I always say like the complexity other than me, I was up for it. I was into it. I loved it. I edited down.


Well you sure had studied it a lot, right? Yeah. Just thinking about the list that you gave at the beginning.


Exactly, but what state of mind when you look at it, you see that in a way it's the hidden variable underneath it all and it can amplify experience and strengths and weaknesses and upset or you know, it can derail something. I started to realize, I go, yeah, I could teach a leader how to have a really effective conversation. I could work with an entrepreneur and help them really look at what's needed in the way that they build their clients. Right? They go into a conversation and they're stirred up, irritated, upset, anxious. All that training goes out the window. I think in a very simple way, we totally get it. In a more stirred up, anxious, uptight mind. I don't do as well as when I'm in a free or more present mind.


Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah. Does. I think one of the things that is coming up in my mind and I imagine might be for others as you talked about the difference between, or earlier you were saying, I used to think I had to up my vibration and sometimes when I hear about state of mind I can get the two kind of confused. Like how are they different?


Yeah. Well first of all, do you see it? Do you see that we're all, all humans, no matter who you are, are walking around in a state of mind at any given time. Now what I want to say right now is we're talking about something and we're making it visible. I want to caution because this isn't something you have to be hypervigilant about. This isn't about getting a better one. You hear a lot out there about mindset and it's kind of like pen tricks to get your mindset ready or you know, and listen, I'm not saying anything about that. I just want to say that we're pointing to something. Just the simple understanding of do you see that your internal climate, your internal quality of mind is having an effect on your resiliency, your wellbeing, your creativity, your ability to listen, your ability to have rapport, to influence, to be hopeful or hopeless, your ability to bounce back to, you know, see possibilities when it looks dark.

All of that is being affected and comes back to this idea of where we're coming from inside of ourselves, where the quality of our own mind is in any given moment. Once people really see that relationship and it just makes sense, right then I think we kind of naturally write ourselves like there's a way that all of a sudden we're way more equipped when we realize, Oh hey, I'm trying to get creative here and I am upset and patient bogged down, exhausted. You start to naturally see not the best place to get creative where prior I would have been like work through it.


Yeah, of course. Yeah, go onto your toolbox. I mean this huge toolbox of strategies and what do you do instead? What do you do instead when you know, you can see. I can see this of course. I mean I get to be in this conversation with you regularly and in the world, but I also am kind of looking at this from there are a lot of people who are listening to this who probably haven't heard this directly before or maybe in this way. I can imagine a lot of like, well wait, how is it? How is it that different than then what happens right after that? Okay, so I see it, I see that I am, I'm caught up or you know, in a bad state of mind. Now what?


Well. Yeah, that is the perfect question because what that leads to is the second piece of what I was saying, Michael, and many other teachers now have begun to show me is that first do you see it, do you use say to mind is having an impact in effect and you know, like you said, most people are like, Oh yeah, once, now that you say that. Yeah, of course. Well then the next piece is to really understand how it works and how we are, you know, I'm going to say like, you know how the, nobody argues that our bodies have this innate intelligence that, you know, our hearts be we blank, we Bre, you know, we cut ourselves and it tries to heal. Right? Well that intelligence exists in our mind as well. But again, it's something that we haven't really talked much about until recent years. We haven't really seen or studied or understood, but when you see like Oh, left to its own devices, our minds clear left to its own devices. You know, we get those creative problem solving ideas. You know, it's like when people say they've done when do you get your best ideas? The top three are in the shower driving and nature. People think, well, do I have to shower all day long?

No, but what it points to is the reason those times are popular aren't because of the activity you're doing. It's because of what your mind is doing and, in those moments, and your mind in a free or natural mind, we get [inaudible], we get moments of insight, we get creative solutions. You see that? Oh yeah. Again, in that space, that's where it's coming from. So when we see thought, when we have a different relationship to thought, when we see that thought is shaping my experience, but beyond this temporary experience, there's something else. There's more to the story. It helps us have a different relationship to thought and feeling. As a result, in that space, you know, let me just say like, I used to have a lot of thinking. I respected all my thoughts; thought they were giving me valuable information. Well since looking at this I can see like, Oh, some thoughts grabbed my attention more than others.

In the space, having the distance from thinking is where the juices, because then when we have some space between our thoughts, we see we are in our thoughts, we see our thoughts are just telling us a current story, not a bigger truth. In that distance and space and having a little less respect for all the thinking, you start to tap into naturally fall into kind of that deeper intelligence inside all of us that kind of wiser, smarter, more common sense. Right. An example of it is, you know when you're really uptight and upset maybe with a loved one or a client and you can feel how reactive you are, but there's this other voice that kind of says, hey, don't do it. Right. Good.

Always listen to that voice and that's just a simple example of kind of in a freer mind. By free or I don't mean no thought, I just mean a freer and less gripped. Our internal state, we naturally get this wiser, more helpful and more common sense thinking and you see, it was me building my relationship to that deepening my relationship to that piece versus all my thinking and my feelings and my strategies. It was starting to realize like, Oh yeah, each one of us comes with that deeper nature, that essential nature, that kind of wisdom, intuition, whatever you want to call it, whatever works for you. That human spirit and I started to realize like when anybody gets more curious about that and has their own personal learning of that, their own felt knowing of it, what starts to happen is all of a sudden they're more resourceful. They're more creative, they're bouncing back, they feel their resiliency more and that by the way, may sound elusive, may sound kind of intangible, but it becomes incredibly practical when we are needing to pivot fast, when we need to be adaptable, when we need to think on our feet, when we need to be creative, when we need to have rapport and connection. You see that all those things are beyond thought, absence of thought, less gripped by thought. We are just naturally better at all those things.


Yeah. Now I'm kind of thinking about again, this current, you know, situation that we're in in the world and you work with a lot of leaders who are running businesses and I imagine that they're coming to you like I have with just sort of like how do I remind me how even if we know this sort of, we kind of fall back on what should I do next? Wait a minute. Something new is happening in the world and suddenly it feels like we need to do a bunch of different stuff now. How are you thinking about it and how are you talking with people about that?


Yeah, I think the first thing I would say is that making your mental wellbeing and taking care of yourself is the priority here. I know that there are a lot of great resources on doing that, but what a, just speak for me, what I'm, what I'm really speaking to is be gentle with yourself. Nurture yourself, sleep, you know, do all those things that Justin you do right now, but the other thing I want to say is, I'll just give you a couple of examples of, I have one executive that I'm working with and they're in the financial industry and you know, it's pretty crazy right now. They're all working extreme hours and she and I were having a conversation and she said, you know, the one thing that helps me is realizing that when I'm worried the worry is coming from what I'm doing with my mind, not the circumstances.

That simple yet incredibly profound understanding helps her write herself during it because she, when she realizes, so yeah, the worries coming from what I'm doing with my mind, she naturally will lean back from that. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, go ahead. No, go ahead. Well, I know that right now it must, it looks like the external circumstances caused a lot of new things in our brains though. Yeah. Well, but I think people can see this simply, that circumstances don't predict what your mind will do. It just doesn't work that way. Yeah, it's true. Our minds can go anywhere with any situation and any circumstance. So knowing that is a huge superpower because you realize, Oh, I can have any thinking about any situation or any person at any time. That means that yes, at times we get worried, we get stirred up, we feel bogged down.

That's all true. That's a part of the human experience, but to know that it's not our thoughts in a way, we have the ability to have a fresh thought. We see it, we're doing it now. If you listen to people you see, it's like we can have a day or while we're going down a track. I know for me, when I got back from Scotland a couple of weeks ago, I got really worried I was going to bed. At the end of the day I'm like, I'm so anxious and I realized, oh, I had spent most of the day thinking about my brothers and sisters and thinking about some people that have had to, you know, shut down their doors and thinking, I have complete compassion for myself for doing that one. I saw it. I'm like, that's why I'm anxious just because where I put my mind all day.


Just seeing that just gives you the opportunity for new, is that a new thought or a new way of seeing no juice there? Right, that oriented me back to Barb, you got to stay in the here and now and that's what I would say also for your list versus right now the greatest resource we have is our ability to be present and to see what is with as neutral mind as possible. So in place you are getting helpful thinking, but we're too far ahead in our minds. We're wanting to know what's happen next week, what's going to happen in a year from now, what's going to be with my business. But if you come back to the here and now and you just simply look at what's on your plate, what's right in front of you, you will get, and sometimes right now those ideas are, you're fine.


Just relax. Right? Sometimes it's grow, walk. Sometimes it's, Hey, have you thought about calling that person? Or Hey, you have some time. Why don't you try this? Again, if we try and solve our big questions right now, you're going to stumble. We have everything we need in the here and now and that's why, you know, and I just want to give you one other example because I think it may be helpful being to another entrepreneur who has multiple businesses and one of them he's had to shut down because it's a physical space and so there's no income coming in and he's worried about his employees. He shared that he spent a few days just kind of really upset about it and you know, trying to figure it out and feeling really like helpless about it. Then really had a lot of thinking about those conversations that he would have to have and it just looked dire.

Then he realized, I'm reactive right now. I'm not neutral. I lost in my head and I've been in my head for days. I need to come back. I need to just get this off my mind. I need to go do something else because you're in a more settled mine. He would get different ideas and sharing enough. When he got more neutral and he had some space, he started getting creative ideas about how to take care of the employees. I want to say about that is none of those ideas were there when he was stirred up, live in mind, thinking up all the scary future things. None of those were even in his consciousness. Again, it was when he was willing to just come back, settle down, let his mind settle, get present, do other things that he started to access his creativity again.


Yeah. That is so, I mean that resonates so strongly for me too because I think I got caught up in, I haven't felt a lot of anxiety. There are two things that are occurring to me. One is I keep hearing, don't panic, you know, overwhelming anxiety and I'm over here like almost sort of secretly going, I don't feel that anxious. Why is everybody telling me that I should be anxious? That's been one sort of set of thoughts and then feelings, mixes, but then in another, just sort of like sub domain in my life and really around, I had a plan for where I was going in my business and I didn't even know that I was sort of getting all caught up in how that wasn't going to work and what the ramifications were of that and what were we going to do about it.


It was like an old, just like an old tape started playing with new words in it and then it's almost like I could picture myself turning my head toward it. You know how when you see something and I'm like, Oh look, I'm doing that. The picture just kind of all dissolved. It just dissolved and it wasn't actually, even the picture like that wasn't even true and it wasn't like I went in and said, is this true? Not that I think there's anything wrong with that at any given point, if that's what shows up, but it just sort of fell away. It's been interesting. Back to your whole, you know how you were saying that, well, when you realize that your thoughts are what create those feelings and that no circumstance creates a particular set of thoughts. Well, I keep seeing that with the external kind of headlines and my own going, wait a minute, but I have the same external circumstances supposedly. I'm not feeling it the way I keep reading about


I'm hearing that a lot and I think it's cool that you're bringing it up because I do, I mean in the, in the news you hear like, Oh don't panic. People are panicking and, and listen, I have a brother-in-law that owns a restaurant. I have some friends that do. I know people are like having to like majorly adjust and it's stressful times. I, in no way want to diminish that, but even my brother and mom, it's like a share a story that you know, he was basically as soon as they had to shut restaurants, rely on foot traffic. Right? That was like an immediate like what am I going to do? And so he was thinking through the delivery stuff and finally a couple of days later, he lives in a neighborhood that is an area of town where there are a lot of Catholic churches and the churches couldn't meet anymore and it's lent.

They do fish fries. It's a common kind of practice. He, right, this is where you start to see like we're desiring to rise to the occasion and one just got more like what can I do today? Right. Versus thinking about all the implications. He got oriented to like, okay, what can I do today? He had the thought come through, let's do fish fries. Well, he'd never done one before. He's like, fry a bunch of fish at once. Well then when he shared the idea to guys in the community who help out at different parishes showed up and said, we'll help you. Then his employees were like, we're there and then people started spreading the word and sold. It makes me cry. Oh, I could cry talking about it too. That's what you want to see. Like that ability, like that wisdom that I, DIA came through my brother-in-law because that's what was on his plate, literally and figuratively.

Right, and that's what I'm seeing over and over when people come back to, okay, what's to do today? What's the thing like we're designed coming back to the way we're designed, we're designed to rise to the occasion to figure things out, to find our way and I think it's when we look there versus in following our thinking down a scary path, which we will do. We're human, but just to say again, as soon as we wake up and we realize that's what we're doing, we can come back to, to the here and now.


Yeah, yeah. That's exactly so perfect and I'm just, I'm so grateful that you had time to talk with me when you did and that I get to share this conversation and your wisdom. I mean, this perspective, what you've helped me see more and more in my own business and in my life really is so life changing. I know that people right now are asking themselves, what am I going to do? What should I do?  just love the idea that maybe, maybe they will see that glimmer and that glimmer will grow. That they have so much that we all have so much wisdom guiding us when we can just look toward it.


Yeah, absolutely and I'm like you, Michelle. I said at the beginning of our call, I've been so blessed to learn from so many different people throughout my career and to practice and to teach and to be a student of so many different things. Yet when I began to have a different relationship to thought, to see States grind and to see this kind of deeper nature, this ability we all have, it transformed everything in a way that it has gives me a home base and a place to remember to come home to that is full of the richness of life and clarity of mind and love and wellbeing and resilience. I can think of nothing more important for all of us right now and what you know in our businesses and in our lives.


Yeah, me either. Thank you so much for this.


Yeah, thank you for doing this, for doing everything you can right now to get as much helpful content out to people. It's really lovely.


See what I mean? Even after many hours of conversation with Barb over the years as my coach and mentor teacher, I mean I spent three whole days at an intensive retreat with Barb. I still am just every time I get to listen and be reminded of these truths that she's sharing, just something in me gets so calm and peaceful and I know that's because it's already living in us all the time and it's so powerful to have someone point us in that direction. When you hear me talk about that were made for this in many ways, this is where I'm pointing, this is what I want you to see, you being made for this and that sort of regular reminder that I share in this podcast. It's not just, it's not just so that we have consistency across our messaging. It is because at the deepest parts of this call you have to serve.

I know that that is your wisdom. That's your wisdom guiding you in the direction of your rightful work in the world of your way of surveying of that deep place of knowing that's in you all the time. When I say you were made for this, my friend, I mean you were made for this and it is my great honor and gift and joy to remind you of that every single week, which I already can't wait to do next week. I will see you here. Then meantime, take really good care and I'll see you here in about a week.

Thank you so much for being here with me on the Brilliance at Work podcast. . If you want to know how to tap your own most natural charisma as a leader and a speaker, you can download a free copy of Lead with Your Natural Charisma, Inspire and Motivate Your Team and Beyond with Ease at http://brillianceatwork.com/naturalcharisma.


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